Curse

Zinger314 · May 23, 2007, 03:09 AM // 03:09

There are many, many Elites in Guild Wars that are underpowered, nigh unusable. Why? Elites should be elite! All players should consider all Elites in a build, not just one or two!

Thus. I’ve taken the liberty to analyze every underused Elite and fix them so that they are more balanced, and hopefully, would be used more often by both players in PvP and PvE.

I haven’t put some Elite skills on this list for 3 reasons:

1) They are fine.
2) They suck so much that they are impossible to fix (Hello, Glimmering Mark!)
3) They are too delicate to balance (see all Ranger Nature Rituals)

(NOTE: All scaling is 0 . . . 12, because I hate ArenaNet’s 0 . . . 15 system.)

Warriors

Axe Mastery

[skill]Cleave[/skill]

Increase range from “target foe” to “target foe and one adjacent foe.”

Makes it a slightly weaker Triple Chop, but with the advantage of no recharge time.

[skill]Decapitate[/skill]

Add “cannot be blocked”

It’s a big gamble already in the current metagame with Aegis flying around. Unblockability adds a little flexibility.

[skill]Whirling Axe[/skill]

Add “+10 . . . 34% chance to critical hit.”

Whirling Axe prevents Warriors from using other attack skills. Might as well give them a better reason for sacrificing so much…

Hammer Mastery

[skill]Backbreaker[/skill]

Add “cannot be blocked” and a cast time of 1/2 second.

It allows Backbreaker to be the ultimate tactical melee interrupt.

[skill]Earth Shaker[/skill]

Increase range from “adjacent foes” to “nearby foes.”

Adjacent sucks, really. This kind of skill particularly needs a larger range.

[skill]Enraged Smash[/skill]

Remove maximum bonus damage cap, but increase cost to 4 adrenaline.

Without a damage cap, Enraged Smash could be very, very fun. (but, of course, the cost would be overpowered with such a low cost, so that would need to adjusted.)

[skill]Magehunter’s Smash[/skill]

Add “cannot be blocked.”

If they have Enchantments, they probably have Aegis and/or Guardian. This provides options.

Strength

[skill]Battle Rage[/skill]

Increase running speed to +33%, and cause double adrenaline from damage taken.

Minor tweaks.

[skill]Defy Pain[/skill]

Increase armor gain to +10 . . . 34.

Makes Defy Pain more of a protypicial “survival” skill.

[skill]Primal Rage[/skill]

Add a 25% increased attack speed.

Flavor.

[skill]Rage of the Ntouka[/skill]

Change recharge so that it only affects the next 2 adrenal skills.

Allows for some creative skill manipulation; will you save the important attack skills for later, or will you use them early?

[skill]Warrior’s Endurance[/skill]

Add a +18 . . . 52 self heal on each hit.

Endurance…without health gain? Odd.

Sword Mastery

[skill]Quivering Blade[/skill]

Add Bleeding for 10 . . . 22 seconds.

Parallels Crippling Slash and assists Gash.

Tactics

[skill]Soldier's Stance[/skill]

Add +4 . . . 9 damage per hit while affected by a Shout or Chant

Gives it a needed damage boost; it’s barely better than Frenzy!

Ranger

Expertise

[skill]Archer's Signet[/skill]

Reduce recharge to 30 seconds.

No Elite should have a recharge of 45 seconds unless it makes the user God. (some do, unfortunately.)

[skill]Expert's Dexterity[/skill]

Reduce attack skill cost increase to 50%

Rangers aren’t made of Energy. How would a Ranger utilize the quicker recharge if they ran out Energy immediately? The 50% effectively equalizes Expertise’s cost reduction at high levels.

[skill]Trapper's Focus[/skill]

Add “cast traps 50% faster.”

Trappers Focus is moreso a PvP skill, therefore letting it be less susceptible to normal interrupts and faster casting efficiency may help.

Wilderness Survival

[skill]Incendiary Arrows[/skill]

Add “Cripples for 1 . . . 3 seconds.’

Makes the preparation more intimidating, and can be decent pressure in PvP.

[skill]Scavenger's Focus[/skill]

Remove Condition conditional requirement, change “damage” into “life-steal”

This change would turn one of the worst Elites into one of the more fun ones. It’s a portable Order of the Vampire!

Monk

Divine Favor

[skill]Aura of Faith[/skill]

Reduce Energy cost to 5.

10e is a tad too prohibitive for such a passive effect. 5e would make it more usable.

[skill]Peace and Harmony[/skill]

Increase Energy Regeneration to +2

It’s time. Seriously.

[skill]Unyielding Aura[/skill]

Reduce cast time to 1/4 second, increase recharge to 30 seconds.

This is an Elite resurrection spell, thus it should cast the quickest. An instant res would have near endless utility! (but it’s still Elite…)

[skill]Withdraw Hexes[/skill]

Change range to “party members.”

A party-wide Hex removal would be awesome, even if you could only use it once every minute or so.

Protection Prayers

[skill]Amity[/skill]

Reduce recharge to 20 seconds.

This skill makes no sense on a Monk. But a 20 second recharge might allow for some utility on a secondary profession, atleast…

[skill]Life Sheath[/skill]

Reduce casting time to 1/4 seconds

All other Protection Spells do it, why not Life Sheath?

Necromancer

Blood Magic

[skill]Cultist's Fervor[/skill]

Add 25% faster casting and [/b]33% spell recharge[/b], reduce Energy reduction to -5

Blood Frenzy! Now a Blood Necromancer can spam spells as if Soul Reaping wasn’t nerfed! (although such a Necromancer will need to rely on life-stealing…)

[skill]Life Transfer[/skill]

Reduce recharge to 20 seconds.

The skills released with Nightfall trump this skill in both health regeneration and degeneration. Might as well be able to cast it more often.

[skill]Ravenous Gaze[/skill]

Change unconditional lifesteal to 18 . . . 52, change conditional lifesteal to 18 . . . 52.

That makes Ravenous Gaze without the condition being filled equal to Vampiric Gaze, which allows the skill to be useful without requiring the condition.

[skill]Well of Power[/skill]

Reduce recharge to 2 seconds.

Makes it the same as Well of Blood. Don’t see the problem. Well Spamming is a fun tactic in PvE and PvP…

Curses

[skill]Feast of Corruption[/skill]

Increase range to “nearby,” reduce recharge to 15 seconds

Alright, Soul Reapling exploits have been fixed, FoC should be restored…

[skill]Lingering Curse[/skill]

Decrease cast time to 1/4 second.

The 2 second cast time says “We’re going to spike you!” Might as well be a part of the spike.

[skill]Pain of Disenchantment[/skill]

Increase damage to 25 . . . 85.

It’s just as conditional as Spoil Victor; it should have the same damage as a result. Destroy those enchantments!

[skill]Plague Signet[/skill]

Move to “No Attribute” (thereby removing the Curses requirement), reduce recharge to 6 seconds

Monks can make as good a use as Necros can; might as well share the love.

[skill]Soul Bind[/skill]

Increase attack speed reduction to 50%, add a knockdown if target of an Enchantment while attacking.

The attack speed reduction puts it on par with Faintheartedness. The second fix is more flavor (paralleling Soul Barbs), and could have some unpredictable effects.

Death Magic

[skill]Contagion[/skill]

Allow the skill to be cast on allies.

It would basically be a more conditional Tainted Flesh, which would be interesting.

[skill]Discord[/skill]

Remove recharge completely

The 2 second casting time plus the insane conditions make the skill unusable in PvP. Might as well attempt to salvage the skill for PvE by allowing it to be spammed.

[skill]Jagged Bones[/skill]

Reduce recharge to 10 seconds, increase duration to 60 second.

Alright, Soul Reaping has been nerfed, unnerf Jagged Bones a little bit. The duration increase is more of a PvE fix, allowing many minions to be enchanted with Jagged Bones.

[skill]Virulence[/skill]

Remove Condition conditional requirement, remove Disease, add Bleeding

The condition requirement is annoying, since there aren’t many reliable ways for a Necromancer to easily cause a condition in the Death Magic tree. The change of Disease/Bleed is more of a PvP update, as Disease is a no-no in PvP without Tainted Flesh…and that’s another Elite.

Mesmer

Inspiration Magic

[skill]Extend Conditions[/skill]

Reduce recharge to 5 seconds.

The faster recharge is necessary, since with the old recharge, it was more efficient to just reapply the condition…

[skill]Tease[/skill]
Increase range to “half the normal range.”

Touch range + Mesmer doesn’t work and make the skill too much of a gamble for an Elite. Half-normal is safer.

Elementalist

Air Magic

[skill]Gust[/skill]

Change conditional to ”Elemental Hexes”

Gives a little more flexibility.

[skill]Ride the Lightning[/skill]

Increase damage to 10 . . . 82, reduce casting time to 1/2 second, and add an “interrupt” on targeted foe

If a spell deliberately puts an Elementalist in harm’s way, it better be a potent strike!

Energy Storage

[skill]Ether Prism[/skill]

Decrease Energy cost to 15 Energy, increase recharge to 15 seconds

Gives the skill more flexibility on when it can be cast for Energy gain.

[skill]Ether Renewal[/skill]

Decrease recharge to 20 seconds

Ether Renewal can be dangerous, but having it up 7/20 of the time still allows for flexibility.

Water Magic

[skill]Mirror of Ice[/skill]

Allow the skill to be cast on allies, decrease the recharge to 5 seconds

That change would make Mirror of Ice a more powerful Vengeful Weapon, appropriate for an Elite.

Assassin

Critical Strikes

[skill]Seeping Wound[/skill]

Change the skill to cause degeneration for each condition applied

Again, flexibility. Mass degeneration is fun.

No Attribute

[skill]Wastrel's Collapse[/skill]

Reduce recharge to 5 seconds

Uh…maybe?

Ritualist

Channeling Magic

[skill]Clamor of Souls[/skill]

Change damage to armor-ignoring damage.

Compare this skill to Ancestor’s Rage and try not to laugh. Then look at my proposed change. It’s fair.

Communing

[skill]Signet of Ghostly Might[/skill]

Increase time of death to 20 seconds

Spirits are traditionally defensive; 20 seconds gives enough time for your spirits to make an impact.

Restoration Magic

[skill]Preservation[/skill]

Fix AI so that Preservation will always heal the ally with the lowest Health in range

I always thought that was a bug.

[skill]Tranquil Was Tanasen[/skill]

Add a +2 . . . 4 health regeneration

Tranquil Was Tanasen is a survival skill, and it needs a tad more survival.

Spawning Power

[skill]Attuned Was Songkai[/skill]

Increase duration to 60 seconds

Why not?

No Attribute

Paragon

Leadership

[skill]Defensive Anthem[/skill]

Reduce Energy cost to 10 Energy, remove “end” condition

Defensive Anthem is barely better than Aegis in PvE, and is significantly worse than Aegis in PvP. Might as well equalize a bit…

[skill]Focused Anger[/skill]

Fix the bug that caps Adrenaline gain from this skill at 100%, increase duration to 60 seconds

Another “why not?” How many Adrenaline skills do Paragons have, anyways?

Motivation

[skill]"The Power Is Yours!"[/skill]

Change range to “other party members,” remove degeneration drawback

The skill isn’t that powerful in the first place: Look at Aria of Zeal. This buff will make the skill somewhat worthwhile.

Dervish

Scythe Mastery

[skill]Wounding Strike[/skill]

Make the Bleeding unconditional

The whole with enchant/without enchant mechanic is too confusing. When won’t a Dervish have an enchantment? Streamline the skills.

And that’s it for the skills. Yes, I admit some of these changes are flawed; but it’s something immediate to discuss instead of the Weekend events and GW2, right?

EDIT: Removed Energy Surge balance.

TMWNN · May 23, 2007, 03:36 AM // 03:36

some good idea but also some horrid ones, the buff to energy surge in particular is insane, comparing esurge to FoC is not a good idea.

fenix · May 23, 2007, 03:38 AM // 03:38

Wow....your suggestions are so imba...

Cleave: Would make it a bit too strong
Backbreaker: That's a stupid suggestion, it's a 4 second KD...why make it 1/2 sec use time, AND unblockable. GTFO
Earthshaker: Also would be imba the range is fine
Quivering Blade: Bleeding!? WTF ARE YOU THINKING. DAZE + BLEEDING IF BLOCKED. GTFO.
Energy Surge: Do you even play GW? That'd be overpowered like crazy.
Discord: No rech?! Wow.

Really, you should quit GW. You have NO IDEA about balance.

Osi Ri S · May 23, 2007, 03:39 AM // 03:39

I like the changes, and i agree with what youre trying to do, although i wish they would just put Jagged bones back to its original state, 6 sec recharge was awesome

Also Fenix, with quivering blade i think he means you apply bleeding to the foe... not that its applied to you if its blocked.

fenix · May 23, 2007, 03:42 AM // 03:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by Osi Ri S

I like the changes, and i agree with what youre trying to do, although i wish they would just put Jagged bones back to its original state, 6 sec recharge was awesome

Except for the fact that it broke PvP, yeah, awesome.

PvErs should be banned from balancing skills. They have no idea about anything, and always suggest balance that would kill monsters faster, but totally break PvP.

Yes I know it's Bleeding on them. But you are stupid not to bring Plague Touch with Quivering, to transfer Daze to targets. Hence the Daze + Bleeding, then Deep Wound from Gash. Like I said, GTFO.

IllusiveMind · May 23, 2007, 03:45 AM // 03:45

I agree with "The Power is Yours!" buff. -10 EN is absolutely insane and exaggerated for a Paragon. I would prefer weakness condition instead. But there are many elites that are balanced, IE: Plague Signet. Changing it to No Attribute would make it overpowered, like a Plague Touch on steroids. Enraged Smash with no cap would do an insane amount of dmg. Sounds fun but it could be more than devastating, resulting it in another overpowered skill. And for last Quivering Blade, it caught my eye that you added bleeding as a suggestion. I think we have a few swordsmanship skills that adds bleeding, why another? But in overall, good analysis and nice suggestions Zinger.

MercenaryKnight · May 23, 2007, 03:49 AM // 03:49

Um fenix your wrong if it's blocked YOU THE WARRIOR gets dazed. Not the enemy.

Mekkakat · May 23, 2007, 03:56 AM // 03:56

i like what you're trying to do, but no offense, this is all, and by all, i mean all way overpowered. sure, elites should rock, but not all can be breadwinners and autowin buttons. i think the 2 most overpowered you made were Esurge and Cleave.. pretty nuts lol. both, as most of the skills you chose, already work great as is.

Mekkakat · May 23, 2007, 03:57 AM // 03:57

Merc, Fenix is talking about the typical use of Quiv, which is to take plague touch to have a win win against casters bro. thats how most use it.

Zinger314 · May 23, 2007, 04:00 AM // 04:00

Alright. I tried. I was bored today.

I'll admit, I've never played a Warrior. But I've seen enough on how they play competitively.

I'm not sure how you are saying E-Surge is overpowered. Yes, it hits for about 135 armor-ignoring damage upfront, but that's relatively low in the metagame. Shadow/Lifebane Strike foes 110. Backfire does 147. And it's on a 20 second cooldown, so it's not like it's spammable.

Kyle The Piemaster · May 23, 2007, 04:06 AM // 04:06

They have actually done a decent job of balancing skills even though their biggest motive is just making sales. Yeah they've made some pretty stupid buffs/nerfs in the past but do they really care? Well yes of course they care, because they just want to sell more copies of a certain campaign that needs a little help.

You've got some pretty good ideas for buffing some of the more useless skills but you've also taken some pretty widely used skills and buffed them even more: earth shaker, backbreaker, defensive anthem (and you're wrong it is better than aegis in pvp) energy surge.

Put these changes in and heres what you get: 2 backbreakers, 2 esurge wrackers, 1 bsurge, 2 monks, flagger.

and everyone else will just run esurge spike.

then theres gonna be the 1 earthshaker warrior 4 esurge mesmers.

don't forget 4 esurge 4 monk builds in HA.

oh yeah and then there will be the 3 esurge 5 monk teams in HA.

(did I mention you buffed esurge a little too much?)

Edit: just read your post above

I don't think you understand what dom mesmers can do by what you just said. Shadow/Lifebane: Look at how successful blood spike was (before objective change + SR nerf). 110 armor ignoring is pretty significant considering all those excellent blood magic skills (BiP, Vamp Gaze, ... did I miss any?). Backfire isn't AoE and I should hope that a monk won't cast 5 spells at once when he gets backfired like you would get with Esurge spikes. Just browse through the domination skills for 10 seconds. See all the energy denial, shutdown, enchant removal, interrupts, and various hatred skills in there? Thats why domination doesn't need a huge damage spell and it's also why spiritual pain and wastrels got nerfed (After NF sales went through the roof of course). Every team ran 2-3 dom and some just went all out with a 5 dom mesmer spike.

fenix · May 23, 2007, 04:13 AM // 04:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by MercenaryKnight

Um fenix your wrong if it's blocked YOU THE WARRIOR gets dazed. Not the enemy.

Ok so, firstly, learn to read. Secondly, learn to warrior. No one uses Quivering without Plague, the chance of Dazing is too good.

Esurge got nerfed multiple times, because it both does big AoE damage, AND drains energy. Paired with Energy Burn, Signet of Weariness, Mind Wrack, etc, you have a very strong bar. Buffing Esurge like that, is just ridiculous.

Kook~NBK~ · May 23, 2007, 04:24 AM // 04:24

Mesmer Skills:
You think that E-Surge should nearly double in strength? It's fine as is. Using it now on a foe who's in a bunched up group will do a TON of damage. ( I love this skill as a lead off attack when LB farming Margonites in Domain of Secrets)

Extend Conditions is fine as is, too.

Tease - that skill's a joke to me. The "Touched target foe" combined with "This skill ends if that foe hits you" gives me a laugh. If you're a Mesmer, and you're within touching range of a foe, odds are that foe is going to hit you! Get rid of the "This skill ends..." part and it'd be much more appealing

LONGA · May 23, 2007, 04:26 AM // 04:26

I dont agree on the Archer signet thou. 3 sec cast make you missed a lot of important skill intrupt. Beside even I used this one at 10 expertise I still got a few shot left when the duration expire.

Incendary arrow.Dont forget that ranger preparation is very flexible.Pair this one up with fast attack skill or increase attack speed skill and its still deadly.

Scavenger Focus.Agree with this one when I look at Glass arrow(Elite Expertise skill).At same number of attribute glass arrow looks much better.Although Scavenger focus doesnt limit you to use only bow.

The other ranger skill I didnt play with them much so no comment.

Silly Warrior · May 23, 2007, 04:37 AM // 04:37

I'll be the first to admit it, Zinger has too much time!

Good job man, alot of changes I agreed with. I'd love to see most of these elite skills change a bit.

Zinger314 · May 23, 2007, 04:40 AM // 04:40

Alright, alright. Removed the Energy Surge fix. I need to watch some more Observer Mode. The last time I did, the only Elite I saw Mesmers use was Psychic Distraction. But I digress...

Amon Warrior · May 23, 2007, 04:43 AM // 04:43

Zinger,

I salute your knack to do something for which I would have no patience... nor thoroughly analyse their impact in the game.

In my player viewpoint, they are an excellent incite for change in "elite" skills that pertain only a marginal effect. Wouldn't it be great to have problems choosing, not because most elites are bland but because they are all so great?

My post comes in a way to aknowledge your painstaking effort and hoping that people at Anet will acknowledge that as well and take it into serious consideration.

/salute /applaud

fenix · May 23, 2007, 04:43 AM // 04:43

Yeah, well if you look at guilds like Ward Against Noobs [Wa], who used 5 Surge mesmers, and tore people apart, it's easy to see how it can be used to own faces. It's basically the damage paired with crazy edenial that would make Surge so strong with your suggested buff.

HolyHawk · May 23, 2007, 05:01 AM // 05:01

I'll coment on the ones I liked, because like people said, you made some skills way too imba. Your proposed backbreaker was not only more flexible. I'd probably run 4 hammer warriors with that if the skill changed hehe. Anyway:

- Ravenous Gaze: possibly good, but wouldn't that be too powerfull? I mean, those mandragoras can wipe a wurm by themselves without kds.
- Well of Power: wells aren't that safe to be used in the first place, so I agree with this change, maybe a way to advertise well's usage.
- Pain of Disenchantment: yes, it must more punitive.
- Jagged Bones: yes, now this would be ok again. It asked for a nerf before.
- Extend Conditions: yes, maybe 10 seconds, or you can have perpetual dazed in coordination with a ranger.
- Tease: half range sounds better, because the skill works in percentage, not a fixed amount, so it kinda sucks by concept.
- Gust: yeah, elemental hex would make it interesting.
- Ether Prism: keep it at 25e and change break point to 10 e.storage. The problem is not the initial cost of the skill, because if you have more than 50, you always end up getting a lot of energy, it is that elementalists lose versatility because they have to invest too much on e.storage.
- Preservation: either this, or keep the spirit dumb but healing each 2 seconds.
- Defensive Anthem: yeah, agreed pretty much.
- The power is Yours!: I'd rather raise the amount of energy given. Even if you have -10 energy regen, paragons still have adrenaline and signets to rely on. The energy degeneration servers to cripple their natural leadership regeneration.

Concerning the rest of your sugestions, most of them either encourage spike, clearly, and some would be like, rule over everything else. To list a few, energy burn does armor ignoring dmg. You take 3 mesmers and spike an elementalist, everyone nearby will be taking 360dmg. Same thing with clamor of souls, and basically every chanelling spell. Some other sugestions do sound ok, but would be problematic, like lingering curse. If a spike included lingering curse on it, it's quite sure that the target would die. There's no suficient amount of healing so save it. It has to be expensive and cast longer because it is too dangerous once applied. Expert's dexterity also would make ranger a potent and unstopable interrupt machine. You can spam distracting shot forever.

Even if your sugestions might have been too strong, it's good that you steped up to list them. Ritgh now, I don't think skill changes can balance the game anymore. I'd delete some skills actually, to give myself the impression of a real balance. Sounds like a lost cause, like mesmers and pve.

Cacheelma · May 23, 2007, 05:32 AM // 05:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sha Noran

You're worse than Izzy.

No kidding.

Archer Signet at 30-sec recharge = You can keep it on you ALL THE TIME. Is that what you want?

On elites with long recharge. I'd agree that it's a bit inappropriate, but this one in particular lasts for 30sec. It makes sense that it has 45-sec recharge (so that you can't keep it on all the time, I think that's the whole point of it).